Who Will Defend Gay/Lesbian Kids from Being Transitioned and Heterosexualized?

11 Comments for “Who Will Defend Gay/Lesbian Kids from Being Transitioned and Heterosexualized?”

  1. posted by Tom Scharbach on

    Wow, Stephen, you really are digging deep.

    However, I would suggest that you need not panic because 2,500 to 3,000 children in the UK are referred to specialists in gender dysphoria for evaluation, however distressing you may find the prospect that some children, who in days of yore would have identified as gay or lesbian, will be diagnosed as gender dysphoric and treated accordingly.

    Over a 15-year period, that works out to be between 37,500 and 45,000 children who will be evaluated for gender dysphoria in the UK, and, if the 40% figure quoted in the article as the percentage of referred children being treated, that works out to be between 15,000 and 18,000 children who will be treated for gender dysphoria over that 15-year period.

    By way of comparison, roughly 11 million children between the ages of 5 and 19 live in the UK [2011 Census: Usual resident population by five-year age group and sex, local authorities in the United Kingdom, ons.gov.uk Accessed 23 December 2012], so we are talking a small number of children being evaluated/treated for gender dysphoria relative to the population of children in the UK.

    I have less concern about the number of children who might be mistreated by medical/psychiatric professionals in the UK than I do about the number of gender dysphoric children in the UK who likely to be mistreated by their conservative Christian parents (see Christians, Here’s How to Respond if Your Child Claims to Be Transgender, an article also in PJ media, an article, interestingly, using the same Shuttercock image used in the article you linked.)

    I’ve dealt often enough with the aftermath of gay teenagers landing on the streets of Chicago after being kicked out of their fine, Christian homes in Wisconsin, Illinois and Indiana to think that my concern is probably realistic, despite the article’s advice that parents not abandon the child.

    I don’t want to prick your balloon, but your fear that significant numbers of gay and lesbian children will be “lost” if gender dysphoric children receive medical treatment [see “Gender Nonconforming Isn’t Necessarily Transgender” by Stephen H. Miller on April 19, 2017] strikes me as absurd.

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  2. posted by JohnInCA on

    I can’t remember, where does Mr. Miller fall on”banning conversion therapy for minors” laws?

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  3. posted by Bryan on

    Stephen is right; parental efforts to transition kids this young are fueled by old-fashioned homophobia. These parents view their children’s gender nonconforming behavior as a medical condition to be resolved by medication and ultimately surgery so their kids can then lead “normal” heterosexual lives. A few hard years than all will be “well,” whereas queer kids are a constant reminder that their offspring aren’t “normal” and never will be.

    And yet all the good progressives go along with it rather than risk standing up and being called anti-trans.

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    • posted by Tom Scharbach on

      Stephen is right; parental efforts to transition kids this young are fueled by old-fashioned homophobia. These parents view their children’s gender nonconforming behavior as a medical condition to be resolved by medication and ultimately surgery so their kids can then lead “normal” heterosexual lives. A few hard years than all will be “well,” whereas queer kids are a constant reminder that their offspring aren’t “normal” and never will be.

      Do you have a shred of evidence to back up your assertions?

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      • posted by JohnInCA on

        There are some cultures where transitioning is more socially acceptable then being gay. Thailand’s “lady boys” come to mind, and there’s some middle-east country where it’s surprisingly common too.

        But not in America or Britain.

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  4. posted by Jorge on

    I’ve dealt often enough with the aftermath of gay teenagers landing on the streets of Chicago after being kicked out of their fine, Christian homes in Wisconsin, Illinois and Indiana to think that my concern is probably realistic, despite the article’s advice that parents not abandon the child.

    Advice that’s been given for decades and yet it still happens.

    Some parents are truly horrible beings, yet LGBT youth seem to get the worst of them. We might as well try to convert evil parents.

    I don’t see much use of these clinics otherwise. I mean I guess it could help, or maybe it could hurt. Most parents will do okay. They’re a lot smarter than “institutions”.

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  5. posted by Mark M. on

    It’s legitimate to ask how many non-gender-conforming kids are actually trans, and how many identify as trans for a while then end up gay. As for encouraging them to start transitioning before puberty or even shortly thereafter, I understand the argument that the earlier you begin the more effective the physical transition. But it’s also true that the earlier you begin, the greater the risk that kids who would be gay but not trans ends up in a really, really bad place.

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  6. posted by Tom Scharbach on

    As for encouraging them to start transitioning before puberty or even shortly thereafter, I understand the argument that the earlier you begin the more effective the physical transition. But it’s also true that the earlier you begin, the greater the risk that kids who would be gay but not trans ends up in a really, really bad place.

    Those are legitimate questions/concerns, but in my view we have to trust that parents, working with medical/psychiatric personnel specializing in evaluating/treating gender dysphoria, will come to the right decision in individual cases.

    My point is simple: Despite “the sky is falling” hysteria from a few in the LGBT community, (1) the numbers of children/adolescents being evaluated/treated for gender dysphoria is not significant in relation to both the general population of children and the subset of gay/lesbian children, and (2) no evidence exists that gay/lesbian children/adolescents are being forced by homophobic parents to undergo gender transition treatment.

    In a word, the sky is NOT falling, or doesn’t seem to be falling at any rate.

    Although I’m well aware that (as Jorge put it) “some parents are truly horrible beings” and abuse is possible, evaluation/treatment of gender dysphoria is subject to checks/safeguards designed to reduce/eliminate mistreatment. Although checks/safeguards can never be 100% effective, this is not a situation in which widespread abuse is likely, as has been demonstrated to be the case with respect to “conversion therapy”.

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  7. posted by Bryan on

    Those are legitimate questions/concerns, but in my view we have to trust that parents, working with medical/psychiatric personnel specializing in evaluating/treating gender dysphoria, will come to the right decision in individual cases.

    Why should we trust these parents when we don’t trust parents who send their gay kids to conversion specialists, who also view themselves as “experts.”

    Medical experts, by the way,are ripe with biases — if you have an issue with your hand and go to a orthopedic surgeon, he’ll recommend surgery. If you go to a credentialed physical therapist, he’ll recommend a physical therapy regime, warning you to disregard the surgeon’s advice because “surgeons like to operate” (trust me on this one).

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  8. posted by Tom Scharbach on

    Tom: Those are legitimate questions/concerns, but in my view we have to trust that parents, working with medical/psychiatric personnel specializing in evaluating/treating gender dysphoria, will come to the right decision in individual cases.

    Bryan: Why should we trust these parents when we don’t trust parents who send their gay kids to conversion specialists, who also view themselves as “experts.”

    The two situations are as different as chalk and cheese, Bryan.

    Conversion therapy has been completely discredited. It doesn’t cure; it causes harm. That’s why states are banning the pracitce. A parent opting to put a child in conversion therapy at this point is either acting out of invincible ignorance or malevolence, one or the other.

    The more telling consideration, however, is one that you elect to ignore (see your comment “Stephen is right; parental efforts to transition kids this young are fueled by old-fashioned homophobia. These parents view their children’s gender nonconforming behavior as a medical condition to be resolved by medication and ultimately surgery so their kids can then lead “normal” heterosexual lives.“)

    The decision whether and how to treat gender dysphoria is not the parents’ alone, as is the case with conversion therapy. Treatment of gender dysphoria is a complex process, involving a team of medical/psychiatric personnel, and decisions made by the medical/psychiatric team are reviewed before decisions are finalized. A system of checks and balances exists, and if the checks and balances work properly, it is next to impossible for a parent alone, however homophobic and/or religious that parent might be, to dictate a course of treatment.

    The short answer to your question is that we don’t leave the gender dysphoria treatment decision to parents alone, trust them or not.

    In the United States, anyway. In the United Kingdom, which foisted Milo Yiannopoulos upon the world, anything is possible, I suppose.

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  9. posted by John Herr on

    This article really speaks to me. To give my own experience. When I was young, under 6, I seemed to my mother as typically “Male”. I was aggressive, outgoing, wanted to play with cars/trucks, and I would often beat up other boys who bullied my female cousin. Then sometime after age 6, up to about age 13, I suddenly changed. I got much more studious, wanted to spend my time reading, hated sports, and got very close to my sister. We would play with dolls, dollhouses, and often I thought I should have been a girl. I even sometimes (not that often), tried on girls clothes. I was bullied incessantly at school, and my parents brought me to psychologists. This was in the 1970’s. Not one of them mentioned transitioning to being a girl, nor did they try to keep me a boy. I don’t remember much beyond that.
    Then after age 13, I ended up in the middle. No more did I want to be a girl, but I didn’t really care for traditional masculine things, like sports. I was a book worm, reading, watching movies, studying weather and geography. And I found myself quite attracted to some males, but never females.
    By college, I was definitely gay, there was never any question of that. But no more did I ever feel female or that I should have been female. I just never developed a taste for the traditional masculine. And the happiness at being male grew stronger with each passing year. Now in my 50’s, I’ve happy with myself, and happy to be gay. I shiver at the thought that if it was now, people may have encouraged me to become a girl back when I was a child. How would my life have ended up?
    I often wonder what changed me around age 6. My mother came from a family of women, and they used to talk about how terrible men were around me when I was growing up. Maybe I took that to heart at the time and felt they wouldn’t like me if I was male. My female cousin tells me she’s sure that’s why I’m gay. But I actually don’t remember that being very important at the time. I remember more just thinking I wasn’t like the other boys, so I must be more like a girl. I suppose that was the budding gay in me. I don’t know what happened really. I got a lot of grief for not wanting to play sports, and I felt at the time, that it would be easier being a girl.

    But I do know this. I am very, very happy being male now. I’m happy interacting with other gay males, as male. I have no desire to change my sex, and haven’t since my teens. I’ve been well adjusted as an adult.
    Sometimes I think people just want to pigeon hole children into Masculine or Feminine rolls based on sex, and they now want to force us to become the other sex if we don’t conform. And with all the attention on it, people themselves feel that they must become the other sex if they prefer the attributes of that other sex.
    I don’t mean to suggest, though, that there isn’t such as thing as being transgendered. It just isn’t me. I’m just thinking that maybe it isn’t such a good idea to push children into it, not until they are older and have more experience with life and what they want from it. How does one know at that age that they are transgendered, and not like me, just gay and feeling different?

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