Just because it’s June, a classic from the Onion: Gay-Pride Parade Sets Mainstream Acceptance of Gays Back 50 Years.
Yes, much gay activism has advanced our right to equality—and much activism has been corrupted by mindless leftwing dogmatism, ‘diversity’ authoritarianism, antinomian sexual exhibitionism, or hijacked by partisan subservience. I’m just saying…
29 Comments for “June Is Bustin’ Out All Over”
posted by Houndentenor on
*yawn*
It’s so much easier to attack the people trying to do something constructive than to do something yourself. What have you accomplished for gay rights. In my lifetime those leftists you hate so much managed to make it okay for gay people to be out without fear of arrest, losing our jobs (in some states anyway) and gained widespread acceptance of gay people in our society. Was the method of getting us to where we are now perfect? Of course not. Have we accomplished everything we want to? No, not yet. But I can’t help but think that if people like you had your way we’d all still be hiding in the shadows hoping we aren’t arrested for sodomy, lose our jobs and even go to a mental hospital for shock treatments to “cure” us.
Yes, you have a right to criticize what other people do. But this annual line of attack from homocons against Pride was tired 20 years ago when I first came out.
posted by Doug on
Well said. Thank you.
posted by Matt on
Yes, the “I’m just saying…” is superfluous and annoying, but the linked Onion article has the virtue of revealing a true and observable fact about the world.
Your notion that people who criticize aren’t “doing anything” is itself tiresome. The four issues Mr. Miller points out – “mindless leftwing dogmatism, ‘diversity’ authoritarianism, antinomian sexual exhibitionism, and partisan subservience” are indeed serious problems, and criticizing them is in itself a valuable action.
Your mindset — that “doing something” is what works — is naive. I’m immediately reminded of the Queer Rising protest in which drag queens laid down in a road and stopped traffic during rush hour in New York — for marriage equality. It doesn’t just matter that people “do something,” it matters what they do and if it is effective or not — or even counter-effective.
The accomplishments you credit to “leftists” — like “widespread acceptance of gay people in our society” — are amusing. Maybe the widespread acceptance was achieved not by “leftists” but by gay people of all political persuasions and beliefs choosing to come out and live honest lives and thus affecting the beliefs of their family members, friends, coworkers, and neighbors?
posted by Tom on
Maybe the widespread acceptance was achieved not by “leftists” but by gay people of all political persuasions and beliefs choosing to come out and live honest lives and thus affecting the beliefs of their family members, friends, coworkers, and neighbors?
Dead right, Matt.
All credible evidence — in-depth polls, interviews, academic studies and so on — points to the critical importance of the fact that gays and lesbians all over the country have come out and become visible, changing the perception of gays and lesbians and little by slowly winning over Americans to the idea that gay and lesbian Americans should be treated equally under the law.
I don’t know the demographics of the gays and lesbians who have come out, as opposed to gays and lesbians who remain in the closet or who have come out only to a very limited number of people. But I suspect, as you do, that the demographics are all across the political spectrum.
The next step, it seems to me, is for those of us who are gay and lesbian to quietly (or maybe not so quietly, depending on our personalities) begin insisting that continued unequal treatment under the law is unacceptable to us.
We’ve gained acceptance, for the most part, just by coming out and becoming visible, and now it is time to fight hard to put that acceptance into action, by fighting for equality and making it clear that nothing short of “equal means equal” will do.
posted by ludovico on
OK, so exactly what’s satirical or exaggerated for comic effect about the Onion article–? cf. Folsom Street Fair.
posted by Houndentenor on
I have never been to the Folsom Street Fair. People not interested in leather and kink don’t go and therefore see nothing they would find offensive or disgusting. I also don’t go to “furry” conventions or wife swapping parties or anything else that doesn’t interest me. yes, there’s a problem that the right-wing elements of the media love to show the scantily clad men and drag queens rather than the multiple groups of gay cops, firemen and many other organizations that march in gay pride parades. I don’t have a problem with any of it but it says a lot when people can only focus on the 5% of something that they don’t like as if it were the whole thing.
posted by BobN on
“I’m just saying…”
You’re just annoying.
posted by another steve on
What to make of these lefties who read every line of Miller’s posts, in order to criticize, insult and belittle (often that’s all they have to say), cause hey, they’re lefties, and therefore superior to everyone else? They won’t debate, they just sneer. And in fact, they often make Miller’s case about the oh so smug gay left.
posted by Houndentenor on
It seemed to me like Miller was the one doing the belittling.
It’s easy to sit in the back row and shoot spitballs at anyone trying to do anything. I hear almost nothing from gay conservatives but “I hate liberals.”
I’m happy to debate. Please tell me what in there was a debate topic and I’ll be happy to participate.
posted by Carl on
“And in fact, they often make Miller’s case about the oh so smug gay left.”
Then why does the point need to continue to be made a million other times?
posted by Jorge on
Well here’s an idea. How about we ask the site to fire that loopy anti-Catholic liberal-lite in order to force Mr. Miller to be more centrist? No? Then deal with it.
I know what the hell is wrong with a little entertainment. Seriously.
posted by Tom on
On a different note, there is an excellent interview with former Republican State Senator Jeff Angelo of Iowa, a conservative who started Iowa Republicans for Freedom, about the group and the reception he’s been getting in the Dallas edition of The Edge.
Angelo is beginning the work that the Republican Party needs to do to turn the ship around on “equal means equal” before the ship sinks.
posted by Tom on
The link in the earlier post got screwed up. Here’s a repost:
The article is worth reading, and worth discussion, it seems to me.
posted by Houndentenor on
THIS would be an example of a Republican politician that gay conservatives should be rallying support for. Ted Olson too.
posted by Tom on
I think that it is good to see Republican politicians starting to object to the party’s lockstep long history of “faggot, faggot”, and I think that it is significant that Angelo is an evangelical, coming right out of the heart of darkness. I’m rooting for Iowa Republicans for Freedom, but I don’t count as a “gay conservative”, so I don’t count, period, when it comes to Republican politics. Oh, well.
posted by Houndentenor on
I think it’s odd that the two groups most eager to help out with the anti-gay politics are Mormons and Catholics, the two groups, after gays, most hated by Christian Fundamentalists. If the religious right ever achieved its goals with gays, they’d be the next targets for their bigotry.
posted by Jorge on
His reasoning is not quite my cup of tea. But he has a lot right.
Religious politics should not be a force of isolation and self-importance, it should be one of unity. Now that gay marriage becomes such a divisive thing even in religion, an increasing doubt on the rightness of any one religious political doctrine makes sense.
I find it very distressing that all these enlightened Republicans have chosen marriage as their battleground. I’d rather they focused on being pro-gay and went whereever that took them.
posted by Tom on
I find it very distressing that all these enlightened Republicans have chosen marriage as their battleground. I’d rather they focused on being pro-gay and went whereever that took them.
In Iowa, marriage equality is the battleground, and it wasn’t the “enlightened Republicans” who chose to make it so. The Iowa Supreme Court ruled in favor of marriage equality — unanimously — and the unenlightened Republicans made it a battleground, pushing an anti-marriage amendment (blocked, so far, by Democrats) and a recall of three of the Iowa Supreme Court justices. Your distress may be misplaced, Jorge.
posted by Jorge on
There’s definitely many, many people implicated here. I think there are more important things to do.
Maybe I’ll give it a pass. Every Republican who ponders marriage as a frontier logically needs to accept the need for everything short of marriage. I just wish they were willing to put more action into them.
posted by Carl on
So…any comments on the polls showing that MN’s gay marriage ban will probably pass? Any comments on Mitt Romney’s latest pathetic attempt to get out of once supporting gay rights? Or on the continued delays in DADT repeal? Or on the gay marriage fight in NY?
Instead it seems to be a loop – I think this gay pride post pops up every year, and I’m guessing it would pop up even if all gay pride participants dressed like Lawrence Welk Show performers.
posted by Tom on
Or on the continued delays in DADT repeal?
I’ve apparently missed something, Carl. The DADT repeal schedule set earlier this year by Secretary Gates called for certification toward the end of the year, after training had been completed. As I understand things, training is now about half done, and the schedule remains intact as far as I know. So what’s the delay?
posted by Houndentenor on
Recent history has shown us that even being slightly ahead in the polls means losing at the ballot box. This is very bad news.
posted by Tom on
We need to remember that the amendment vote is 18 months down the pike and that polls aren’t all that reliable at this point.
The most recent poll shows an even split 47% to 46%. A May 13 poll showed a 55% to 39% split in opposition. Polls evolve as opinion evolves.
I agree that an even split means we lose. Religious conservatives, who are driving this effort in Minnesota as they did in other states, have a history of generating a very high turnout rate to vote against marriage. That’s been true in every state where an amendment has been on the ballot. In Minnesota, religious conservatives will be particularly energetic, because their leadership knows that it is critical to set Minnesota in stone now, given national opinion trends, delaying marriage equality a decade or so through the amendment process.
The Republican Party, of course and as usual, is working in lockstep, perhaps out of religious conviction, but more likely, my cynical political self thinks, because they think that a high turnout among religious conservatives will help defeat President Obama in 2012. If my cynical self is correct, the Republicans have been there and done that for years.
But in politics, 18 months is a lifetime.
posted by Houndentenor on
I agree that 18 months is a long time in politics. I didn’t point out the problem between polling and voting to discourage anyone but to point out how much work needs to be done in the next year and a half.
posted by Houndentenor on
I should thank Mr Miller for teaching me the word “antinomian.” I don’t believe I had ever come across that one before but it will come in handy discussing the C Street group and other Christians who feel that the rules they set down for others don’t apply to them. I don’t know how that applies to the gay pride parade, but it is a useful word to know nonetheless.
posted by Wilberforce on
I’ll do this one last time.
For a couple of years, I’ve been trying to get them to produce serious content at Pride. The idea is to carry banners outlining our great people and accomplishments. I think this would be great PR for us, although it may need some additions, of notable women and transfolk.
It’s easy to complain about the shallow crowd. It takes work to do something worthwhile. In that spirit, I offer the following content to anyone who would produce it at a Pride march.
Pride Of Achievement
Modest Gifts From
The LGBT Community
(in olde English script)
The American Continental Army
Trained By
Friedrich Wilhelm Baron von Steuben
(in olde English script)
The Victory at Yorktown
Using The Bayonette Tactic Of
Friedrich Wilhelm Baron von Steuben
(in Civil War script)
The Gettysbug Address
Written By
President Abraham Lincoln
(largest banner, in digital script, with 0s and 1s)
The Computer
Invented By
Alan Turing
(in Times New Roman, with code fragments)
Nazi Communication Codes
Broken By
Alan Turing
Saving Thousands Of Lives In WWII
(in Times New Roman with Greek characters)
Logic And Reason
Created By
Zeno and Socrates
(in Times New Roman with Greek characters)
Democracy
Invented By
Solon
(in olde English script)
The King James Bible
Created by
King James I
(in Times New Roman with Roman characters)
The Pieta
Carved By
Michelangelo Buonarroti
(in Times New Roman)
Brunch
Waffles and Carmelized Pears,
No More Quiche, Please
(in Times New Roman with a spotlight and beam)
Hollywood
Credit Where Credit Is Due
(in Times New Roman with Greek characters)
Democracy
Invented By
Solon
(in olde English script)
The King James Bible
Created by
King James I
(in Times New Roman with Roman characters)
The Pieta
Carved By
Michelangelo Buonarroti
(in Times New Roman)
Brunch
Waffles and Carmelized Pears,
No More Quiche, Please
(in Times New Roman with a spotlight and beam)
Hollywood
Credit Where Credit Is Due
posted by Jorge on
I think this would be great PR for us, although it may need some additions, of notable women and transfolk.
Human history is one of sexism and homogenous gender expression norms. There is no need to fall into the trap of glossing over the omission of notable lesbians and transfolk from recorded history. It is not for the lack of any reason for them to be proud today.
I think women do fairly well at getting around the problem. As for transgendered people, perhaps we’ll just have to include those who are still alive. If there is anyone in this country who supports and values gays as people and strives not to judge people by their gender expression or how well they confirm, that person should be taught to honor Stonewall (or are drag queens something a little different?). Seems like a good start to me.
posted by A-Jay on
A-Jay
>
>Actually being a new age conservative I knew of and know many other fiscally conservative and socially moderate gay/gay friendly individuals who have worked to enable equality of rights for the homosexual community and did so on a number of common ground issues. For well over 20 years they had a keen insight into how to best approach those citizens who were not embraced by the far-left-gay movement because all too frequently hard-line liberationists didn’t fully comprehend how to bridge the gap between communities without enabling hate mongering on both sides of the extreme.
>
>How often we forget that it was President Clinton who enabled DADT and DOMA and it was President Obama who, when campaigning in Black churches, noted that he supported marriage as being between one man and one woman. Those comments led many people of color in, for example, Florida to pass Constitutional Amendment 2 and many of the storefront congregations still utilize the less than appetizing Pride pictures of who and what we are to advance negativism against the community. While liberationists call gays who served in the military “baby killers” others who are Centrists see them as patriots and that’s the plateau on which mainstreamers seek to advance equality of treatment and access based on one’s sexual orientation and not preferences.
>
>As far as equality is concerned gay/gay-friendly new-age conservatives are often blocked and/or blackballed by the so called move-on liberationists agenda. As we see herein, from the array of comments offered, hard-liners and historical revisionist refer to the radical exhibitionists as the only backbone or foundation of the historical equality movement.
>
>Sorry, but there are individuals out there who don’t share the shock therapy agenda of Nimble and FA nor utilize them as their role models in Pride Parades. Yet, because of their sexual orientation and guarantee of “freedom of speech” many understand the rights of such organizations to participate just as heterosexual participate in Mardi Gras festivals in New Orleans and elsewhere. On the other hand those who aren’t labeling themselves as “Queers,” or other endearing liberationists’ terms, don’t advertise job equality based on their particular sexual preferences or behaviors which in some situations often appear publicly offensive. Their route towards their own cohesive mainstream credentials, inclusion, and demonstration of pride in who and what they are as being blended in is expressed differently in the tapestry of society.
>
>Keep your sexually explicit pleasures in the privacy of your bedroom and off the streets where a diverse community of family, friends, and voters hope to mingle with you and thereby demonstrate the importance of inclusion not the reactionary exclusion expressed by some in the referenced article.
>
posted by Houndentenor on
What is a “new-age conservative”?
That’s not a criticism or an attack of any kind. It’s just the first time I have ever heard that term and I am curious what you mean.