28 Comments for “Catholic Sex Scandals Have No End In Sight”
posted by Matthew on
How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?
posted by Jorge on
The whole gay priest thing sounds to me like nothing so much as an attempt at deflection from what appears to be the most serious chapter yet in the church child sex abuse scandal. I do not discuss the child sex abuse scandal; it would be outrageous for me to dignify the gay priest deflection.
How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?
It has something to do with the distance between God and man being some function of the circumference of the Catholic Church. If circles didn’t have radii, we wouldn’t need them. I do not mean in any way to suggest I advocate religious intolerance.
posted by Matthew on
“I do not mean in any way to suggest I advocate religious intolerance.”
It’s hard to tolerate organizations that preach intolerance of people like me. The Catholic Church has crossed the line too many times for me to forgive them.
posted by Jorge on
Mmm-mmm. I read your response to my post in that other topic.
Fine. We’ll do it your way.
posted by Matthew on
They rape kids and attack gays. How should I react to something like that?
posted by JohnInCA on
That depends.
Is your intention to express your outrage, or to persuade people of your righteousness?
If you are merely trying to express your outrage, then feel free to continue along your current path. People are quite aware of the many things you are outraged by.
If you are actually trying to persuade people though, then your lack of civility and decorum does more to damage your cause then your passion helps it.
posted by Matthew on
Civility is a privilege the oppressor classes forfeit through their words and deeds. STOP RAPING KIDS, YOU DIRTY FUCKING BREEDERS!
posted by JohnInCA on
So just expressing your outrage then eh?
Very well, do continue. But you shouldn’t be surprised when people aren’t persuaded, as your actions are not designed to persuade.
Spare your condescending tone-policing, John. You know damn well Christianity is a fraud from top to bottom. And it’s time to stop being so mealy-mouthed and passive in the face of systematic oppression.
The Catholic Church is guilty of homophobia, antisemitism, sexism, racism, imperialism, pedophilia, and for holding back human process in general. And Christianity is to blame for enabling Islam to exist. Yeah, I went there. Islam just took everything wrong with Christianity and made it worse. Both of those racist, sexist, antisemitic, homophobic death cults need to cease to exist. The Jewish God is God.
posted by David Bauler on
Matthew admits to being troll. Says that we should ignore him.
posted by Matthew on
David Bauler is an idiot, a bigot, and a philistine who engages in sockpuppetry and threats of violence.
posted by David Bauler on
Mostly, because of tradition. People rarely change religions, past a certain age. A similar thing explains why some gay people are still Catholic or Republican.
posted by Kosh III on
Fine. Let them expel all the gay clerics in the RCC. I’m sure the remnant will be quite happy to have a few dozen parishes each to tend to. (sarcasm)
posted by JohnInCA on
Like most cases of corruption and abuse, whatever the real “cause” is, it is aided and abetted by the culture is secrecy and deception, created in part by (A) men being shit at celibacy and (B) disproportionally recruiting from gay men while (C) making admitting being gay, regardless of sexual activity, a scandal in and of itself. And the remedy is similarly simple: honesty and transparency.
Of course, in this case “honesty and transparency” would mean, among other things, the Catholic Church admitting that there is no place for gay men in Catholicism. Not as priests, not in the laity, not as janitors.
There are obvious reasons they are unwilling to be so honest. But frankly, it’s like ripping off a bandaid: the sooner they own up to the truth they keep dancing around, the sooner we can all get clean.
To make a long story short: in glass houses, no one diddles kids.
posted by Matthew on
If there is no place in Catholicism for gay men, then there is no place for Catholicism in a civilized society.
posted by Kosh III on
For once we agree; gasp! clutch the pearls.
The basis for opposition to gay people is cultural not religious, no matter how hard they try to pervert the Scripture.
posted by Matthew on
Christians and Muslims stole the Torah and distorted it to turn into a weapon of hate. And they both enabled pedophilia; in addition to the “prophet” Muhammad who took a prepubescent girl for his “bride,” who else but a pedophile would use children as weapons to attack gay people with, especially when every gay person who ever lived or ever will live starts life out as a child?
posted by MR Bill on
If you belong to an organization that has claimed sole ownership of the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven, there is literally no evil you cannot justify…
posted by Stephen on
Matthew was my exlover
posted by Matthew on
Another David Bauler sockpuppet.
posted by David Bauler on
Sock puppets? Oh, please! You already admitted to being a troll.
posted by Matthew on
That was you impersonating me and you know it.
posted by Jorge on
Mostly, because of tradition. People rarely change religions, past a certain age. A similar thing explains why some gay people are still Catholic or Republican.
Even I don’t think Catholicism is the only religion through which God speaks to mankind.
If you belong to an organization that has claimed sole ownership of the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven, there is literally no evil you cannot justify…
When it comes to the level of control that is exerted over individual lives, I think that’s a much better description of Protestantism, with its extremely heavy focus on the text of the Bible, than Catholicism, which draws from the interaction over time between different interpretations of the Bible.
Martin Luther and others did a great service in taking away the priesthood’s exclusive authority to interpret the Bible, but in the process they gave birth to their own petty tyrants, many of them dumber than a box of rocks.
posted by Jorge on
With that being said, there’s a religious discourse in one of my video games (Fire Emblem) that seems relevant to MR Bill’s observation.
“Forgiving your sins is a small task for a bishop. And if that were enough to save you, I would recite the words. But you suffer, and you seek answers. And that is the greatest pain of all, the pain of doubt. If I dispelled this doubt, I could free you from your pain. But then you would be nothing more than a puppet that kills. Use your doubt. Use it to become something more.”
posted by Matthew on
What about Mormons? Where do they fit into this equation?
posted by Tom Scharbach on
E.J. Dionne has a thoughtful response to the question “How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?”, a response that echoes the conversations I’ve had with my Catholic friends over the last few years.
posted by Matthew on
The Vatican is a terrorist state, plain and simple. If Israel invaded it and colonized it, I would shed no tears.
28 Comments for “Catholic Sex Scandals Have No End In Sight”
posted by Matthew on
How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?
posted by Jorge on
The whole gay priest thing sounds to me like nothing so much as an attempt at deflection from what appears to be the most serious chapter yet in the church child sex abuse scandal. I do not discuss the child sex abuse scandal; it would be outrageous for me to dignify the gay priest deflection.
How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?
It has something to do with the distance between God and man being some function of the circumference of the Catholic Church. If circles didn’t have radii, we wouldn’t need them. I do not mean in any way to suggest I advocate religious intolerance.
posted by Matthew on
“I do not mean in any way to suggest I advocate religious intolerance.”
It’s hard to tolerate organizations that preach intolerance of people like me. The Catholic Church has crossed the line too many times for me to forgive them.
posted by Jorge on
Mmm-mmm. I read your response to my post in that other topic.
Fine. We’ll do it your way.
posted by Matthew on
They rape kids and attack gays. How should I react to something like that?
posted by JohnInCA on
That depends.
Is your intention to express your outrage, or to persuade people of your righteousness?
If you are merely trying to express your outrage, then feel free to continue along your current path. People are quite aware of the many things you are outraged by.
If you are actually trying to persuade people though, then your lack of civility and decorum does more to damage your cause then your passion helps it.
posted by Matthew on
Civility is a privilege the oppressor classes forfeit through their words and deeds. STOP RAPING KIDS, YOU DIRTY FUCKING BREEDERS!
posted by JohnInCA on
So just expressing your outrage then eh?
Very well, do continue. But you shouldn’t be surprised when people aren’t persuaded, as your actions are not designed to persuade.
posted by Matthew on
Spare your condescending tone-policing, John. You know damn well Christianity is a fraud from top to bottom. And it’s time to stop being so mealy-mouthed and passive in the face of systematic oppression.
The Catholic Church is guilty of homophobia, antisemitism, sexism, racism, imperialism, pedophilia, and for holding back human process in general. And Christianity is to blame for enabling Islam to exist. Yeah, I went there. Islam just took everything wrong with Christianity and made it worse. Both of those racist, sexist, antisemitic, homophobic death cults need to cease to exist. The Jewish God is God.
posted by David Bauler on
Matthew admits to being troll. Says that we should ignore him.
posted by Matthew on
David Bauler is an idiot, a bigot, and a philistine who engages in sockpuppetry and threats of violence.
posted by David Bauler on
Mostly, because of tradition. People rarely change religions, past a certain age. A similar thing explains why some gay people are still Catholic or Republican.
posted by Kosh III on
Fine. Let them expel all the gay clerics in the RCC. I’m sure the remnant will be quite happy to have a few dozen parishes each to tend to. (sarcasm)
posted by JohnInCA on
Like most cases of corruption and abuse, whatever the real “cause” is, it is aided and abetted by the culture is secrecy and deception, created in part by (A) men being shit at celibacy and (B) disproportionally recruiting from gay men while (C) making admitting being gay, regardless of sexual activity, a scandal in and of itself. And the remedy is similarly simple: honesty and transparency.
Of course, in this case “honesty and transparency” would mean, among other things, the Catholic Church admitting that there is no place for gay men in Catholicism. Not as priests, not in the laity, not as janitors.
There are obvious reasons they are unwilling to be so honest. But frankly, it’s like ripping off a bandaid: the sooner they own up to the truth they keep dancing around, the sooner we can all get clean.
To make a long story short: in glass houses, no one diddles kids.
posted by Matthew on
If there is no place in Catholicism for gay men, then there is no place for Catholicism in a civilized society.
posted by Kosh III on
For once we agree; gasp! clutch the pearls.
The basis for opposition to gay people is cultural not religious, no matter how hard they try to pervert the Scripture.
posted by Matthew on
Christians and Muslims stole the Torah and distorted it to turn into a weapon of hate. And they both enabled pedophilia; in addition to the “prophet” Muhammad who took a prepubescent girl for his “bride,” who else but a pedophile would use children as weapons to attack gay people with, especially when every gay person who ever lived or ever will live starts life out as a child?
posted by MR Bill on
If you belong to an organization that has claimed sole ownership of the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven, there is literally no evil you cannot justify…
posted by Stephen on
Matthew was my exlover
posted by Matthew on
Another David Bauler sockpuppet.
posted by David Bauler on
Sock puppets? Oh, please! You already admitted to being a troll.
posted by Matthew on
That was you impersonating me and you know it.
posted by Jorge on
Mostly, because of tradition. People rarely change religions, past a certain age. A similar thing explains why some gay people are still Catholic or Republican.
Even I don’t think Catholicism is the only religion through which God speaks to mankind.
If you belong to an organization that has claimed sole ownership of the Keys to the Kingdom of Heaven, there is literally no evil you cannot justify…
When it comes to the level of control that is exerted over individual lives, I think that’s a much better description of Protestantism, with its extremely heavy focus on the text of the Bible, than Catholicism, which draws from the interaction over time between different interpretations of the Bible.
Martin Luther and others did a great service in taking away the priesthood’s exclusive authority to interpret the Bible, but in the process they gave birth to their own petty tyrants, many of them dumber than a box of rocks.
posted by Jorge on
With that being said, there’s a religious discourse in one of my video games (Fire Emblem) that seems relevant to MR Bill’s observation.
“Forgiving your sins is a small task for a bishop. And if that were enough to save you, I would recite the words. But you suffer, and you seek answers. And that is the greatest pain of all, the pain of doubt. If I dispelled this doubt, I could free you from your pain. But then you would be nothing more than a puppet that kills. Use your doubt. Use it to become something more.”
posted by Matthew on
What about Mormons? Where do they fit into this equation?
posted by Tom Scharbach on
E.J. Dionne has a thoughtful response to the question “How can anyone still be a Catholic after this?”, a response that echoes the conversations I’ve had with my Catholic friends over the last few years.
posted by Matthew on
The Vatican is a terrorist state, plain and simple. If Israel invaded it and colonized it, I would shed no tears.
posted by David Bauler on
Thankfully….