I have to side with Adam Lambert over Out editor Aaron Hicklin in their recent dust-up. Hicklin is critical of Lambert for conditions Lambert imposed on a cover shoot and interview, and he argues that Lambert is trying to avoid being perceived as "too gay."
No one could fairly argue that Lambert is in the closet, or anywhere close to one. Hicklin's real beef, I think, comes from an assumption that lesbians and gay men - particularly those who are out -- have an obligation not only to be public about their sexual orientation, but also to be politically active. Lambert's failure to fully embrace Out magazine seems, in Hicklin's view, to show that Lambert is backing away from this obligation to the gay community at large.
As someone who's been politically active in gay rights for over a quarter of a century, I sympathize with Hicklin. I, too, wish all homosexuals would spend a lot of their time and resources fighting in the political arena for our equality. It is not fair to us that heterosexuals have made our sexual orientation (not theirs) a political matter, and because we are such a small minority, this places an enormous burden on all of us.
But ever since the time of Harvey Milk, those of us who are active in politics have now and then needed to urge our fellow homosexuals, "Out of the bars and into the streets." Politics does not come naturally to everyone, or even to most people.
I would love for Lambert to use his celebrity to help us cross the finish line to full equality. But the thing is, he earned that celebrity with amazing talent and work, and can use it as he sees fit. He shows considerable and admirable awareness of his own talents and limitations when he says, "I'm not a politician. I'm an entertainer." We can all tote up a personal list of entertainers and others our community has thrust into the political arena to be our champions, only to regret our pushiness. Better for those who are politically inclined -- Dustin Lance Black, Rachel Maddow, Melissa Etheridge -- to take up the cause willingly and competently.
None of this is to say that Lambert will not be helping us simply by being out. Ellen DeGeneres and Neil Patrick Harris aren't expressly political, but like Lambert, just being out is a political act for us, and that's a lot more than any of them, as entertainers, would have bargained for.
Also, remember it took a long time for Elton John to come out, get his balance in the very bizarre world of politics, and develop into a kind of elder statesman. Maybe that's in Lambert's future. He's only in his mid-twenties.
But in the end, that is his choice, not ours.
28 Comments for “For Your Entertainment”
posted by Lymis on
I agree completely.
It is one thing for a closeted or semi-closeted person to bash other gay people, or for someone whose wealth and privilege keep them from the challenges most of us face saying negative or dismissive things about our struggles or our rights.
But one of the biggest (and stupidest) complaints about gay activism is the perception that all gay people are one-note and pushy. People like Ellen Degeneres and Neil Patrick Harris who are openly gay but perceived to be just going about their lives in a non-threatening way serve the community too, just as any of us who are perceived as “that nice couple next door.”
It puts a human face on us, and and if there’s anyone who said, “I disapprove of gay marriage, but I wouldn’t want to hurt Ellen and Portia” and voted against Prop 8, that’s a win. A big win.
And, potentially in the future, when the Ellens and Neils and other non-political folks DO make a stand to their fans, it may have more weight than if they came out of the gate fighting.
posted by esurience on
“I would love for Lambert to use his celebrity to help us cross the finish line to full equality. But the thing is, he earned that celebrity with amazing talent and work, and can use it as he sees fit.”
True. But it’s also true that if activists in the past hadn’t worked so hard, a guy like Lambert wouldn’t be allowed on TV. Does he owe nothing to the people that have made it possible for him to live his life, while being oblivious/ignorant of the politics of it?
posted by Realist on
To esurience: NO HE DOESN’T! Adam made it this far because of talent, personality, voice and the fact he stays true to himself. As far as living his life, he went through his own hell when he was younger. First off Adam is a human being who deserves to be recognized for his talent and contributions to the entertainment industry!
Adam is already making contributions or hadn’t you noticed. He has already effected many people on their thoughts of gay individuals. He has had a serious impact on the way people think, this moving towards the positive by just being himself.
So don’t even bring up oblivious/ignorant of the politics. If he wanted to be a freaking politician he would have run for office. Adam is and always has been an entertainer, first and foremost. How he lives his life is his business. He is where he is “For Your Entertainment”!!
So get over it and let things just take it’s course. Don’t push. Letting him live his life the way he choses is making a statement in itself.
Thoughts for you to ponder.
posted by JB on
I agree completely! He?s an artist first and foremost. And I don’t think people get that he’s in NO position to be any kind of an activist yet! He’s just starting his career and his CD hasn’t even officially come out! Let’s wait and see how it does before we expect him to take such a huge role!!
And for those who don?t know, he did talk about gay marriage in the RS issue where he said He enjoyed performing Sam Cooke’s A Change Is Gonna Come. “This civil rights movement is near to my heart, and it felt really good to sing that,” “I’m not asking to get married in your church but you don’t have the right to tell me I can’t do it”.
So he’s clearly not avoiding all gay topics like some people think!!!
I think the people who have only followed the OUT thing should dig up all of Adam’s print and video interviews and listen to what he has to say! The man CLEARLY doesn’t hide his gay! And supports gay rights! But he has done more to the gay community just by being himself (and talking honestly and openly about his life) than some people realize!
posted by Victoria on
Thank You for this very well stated and consciencious article. I agree with you completely. Adam is very new at his celebrity status. He’s at the start of a career that, up until now, he has only dreamt would happen and all of a sudden it’s happening very quickly. He may not be quite ready to embrace all the expectations that are being thrown at him from every direction. He will realize his full potential eventually but has to be allowed to discover his capabilites on his own. He will contribute in his own way, in his own time. @esurience, I don’t believe for a minute that Adam Lambert is oblivious or ignorant to the plight of the gay community. I don’t know how any gay adult could be. Also, just because Adam is a celebrity does not entitle anyone to expect him to pick up the gauntlet for any political agenda, even gay rights.
posted by terie on
With so much opposition & controversy about what he should or should not do from the gay people how do they expect his acceptance from the straight people… which BTW … he seems to have more of right now. Most of the criticism seems to come from the gays in most of these posts since OUT ed decided to air his disapproval rather than to take it up with ADAM & his management privately. IMO the editor has done more harm than good by publicly chastising ADAM. If he was so upset why didn’t he just SCRAP the deal?
posted by Mark on
Thank you for your article. Adam is working really hard to become a professional recording artist and does not have time for political activism. And I also believe that his being in the public eye helps people to accept differences easier. Adam does not have to answer to anyone, only to himself. His fans do not want him in a box.
As far as I am concerned, Aaron Hicklin stepped over Adam’s boundaries and should fully apologize to him. I was really looking forward to that magazine, oh well. Thanks again for your well thought out article.
posted by Bobby on
“Adam is working really hard to become a professional recording artist and does not have time for political activism.”
—Tell me, is it political activism for a male breeder to parade his bimbo in front of the cameras? Is it activism when Leonardo DiCaprio locks lips with the latest trophy? Ellen Degeneres took Anne Heche to the White House and was romantinc with her girlfriend in front of President Bill Clinton. I’m not asking that Lambert move mountains, but if he really is gay then perhaps he should stop showing it, after all, the breeders already do.
posted by Jorge on
I know nothing about Out magazine, so this may miss the mark. But can you imagine Rush Limbaugh or Sean Hannity saying Barack Obama doesn’t go on their shows because he’s afraid of being perceived as too patriotic or too religious?
I think he has a responsibility to be a good role model for gay and gay-friendly youth, and from what you’re saying he’s already doing some good things. It’s far more important for him to live a successful and scandal-free life than for him to be politically or socially active.
posted by Bobby on
“But can you imagine Rush Limbaugh or Sean Hannity saying Barack Obama doesn’t go on their shows because he’s afraid of being perceived as too patriotic or too religious?”
—Obama is neither patriotic nor religious, not only does the first family not attend church regularly but they go to Europe and apologize for America’s “arrogance” and other “mistakes.”
Besides, Obama doesn’t have the guts to face Rush or Sean, I’m even surprised he faced O’reilly and I doubt he will do it again. Our fuhrer prefers to be in the company of the media that loves him, so dare I say it? He’s either a coward or an elitist who would rather be with ass kissers than critics.
Moving on, I do wish Lambert career success but if he was dating before American Idol and after American Idol then why not share that with the rest of America?
We already have “Brangelina” and “Bennifer” so why not Lambertin (if he hooks up with Ricky Martin)? Jesus Christ, I really hate gay celebrities that downplay their homosexuality. Hello? You’re supposed to be out just like the breeders are out!
posted by Art on
You talk just like a gay man of your generation. Making excuses for gay people in the closet, and that want to distance themselves from the lgbt community for whatever reason! What Adam lambert did was disgusting and disrespectful not just to out, but yes to the lgbt community. Not wanting to be” to gay”.. And refusing to be on the cover on less a straight person was on it, reason why they got cindy loaper on the cover. Can you imagine Jennifer lopez telling latina magazine not to make her look to Latina. Or beyonce refusing to be in a group cover if a white person was not on it!
There is no excuse for what he did. And while adam is trying so desperately to desassociate himself from the gay community and there stupid problems, he better remember in the dance music world if gay people don’t like your music, no one likes your music.
Oh! And I wish Adam would have 1/4 of the grace and pride that Neil patrick had with being out.
ps. I’m only a singer is as played out as I was just fallowing order it just a cop out to not do the right thing!
posted by David in Houston on
“But the thing is, he earned that celebrity with amazing talent and work, and can use it as he sees fit.”
Yeah, that’s true; and I can decide to not spend my money on gay people that don’t give a crap about civil rights for LGBT people. Hopefully he’ll find the love of his life and want to get married, then he’ll realize how self-absorbed he is. PS: If you don’t support the gay community, it’s not going to support you.
posted by L on
Bobby – He did have a boyfriend. There are paparazzi pictures and videos of them going out, holding hands and kissing.
Art – Neil Patrick Harris actually feels the same as Adam on the I’m only a singer. He told Out magazine “My job is jester, not advocate…I’m striving to be an example of normalcy.”
posted by JB on
“Moving on, I do wish Lambert career success but if he was dating before American Idol and after American Idol then why not share that with the rest of America?”
Like someone said, he did have a boyfriend! And he did talk about him in interviews many, many times! You might also want to check their Twitter conversations, which is pretty fucking public for everyone to see. And have you ever considered that maybe it was his (now ex) BOYFRIEND who didn’t want to be in the public eye!? He seems really shy!
“Yeah, that’s true; and I can decide to not spend my money on gay people that don’t give a crap about civil rights for LGBT people. Hopefully he’ll find the love of his life and want to get married, then he’ll realize how self-absorbed he is. PS: If you don’t support the gay community, it’s not going to support you.”
Did David in Houston read my comment above?!!? “And for those who don?t know, he did talk about gay marriage in the RS issue where he said He enjoyed performing Sam Cooke’s A Change Is Gonna Come. “This civil rights movement is near to my heart, and it felt really good to sing that,” “I’m not asking to get married in your church but you don’t have the right to tell me I can’t do it”.”
How the fuck is that not caring?! Don’t pretend to know anything about him when you clearly don’t.
posted by North Dallas Thirty on
Well, that’s entertaining. Now we see that there’s a whole list of things that you have to do to be a “real gay”.
— Support and endorse Obama and the Obama Party in all circumstances
— Parade how promiscuous you are and talk about how gay you are constantly
— Spend all your time at public protests screaming about how you need “marriage equality” (unless, of course, that would embarrass or make life difficult for Barack Obama and the Obama Party, at which point you support bans on gay marriage)
In that case, I put Perez Hilton forward as an example to the United States of what “real gays” are like. In fact, I would publicize to everyone that Perez Hilton, who meets all the requirements that Art, esurience, and David are putting down, is the classic example of a “real gay” and exemplifies in every way the values of the gay community.
posted by Debrah on
“North Dallas Thirty” might be a bit more conservative than I; however, you cannot argue with his ability to illuminate the extraordinarily hilarious hypocrisy of the Left.
Anything—and I mean ANYTHING—that might question the Democratic Party and their Far Left “beauty parlor chic” will be met with attack after attack.
I am reminded of the attempt at intimidation by a few Cocksox-brief-sniffers on this blog when I dared come here and question the gross double standards gay men take for granted and live by.
Even the most intellectual of gay men seem to be unable to resist behaving like little b!tchy girls and supporting acne-faced-Liberace’s of the 21st century like Perez Hilton.
There is no respect given to gay men who want to excel in their fields and not spend their waking hours singing the praises of the sewer smells of fudge-packing.
Many inside the gay community are simply a group of obnoxious people…..ready to help destroy the careers of anyone who will not spend their lives touting the “gay life”.
I suppose that’s why some usually level-headed people are coaxed into this boring and navel-gazing way of life, ultimately.
It is truly a destroyer of creativity and intellect.
posted by Regan DuCasse on
NDT and Debrah,
Well, we can count on you to be uncharitable, but let me put it this way:
I don’t hear that YOU have any great ideas.
I don’t get the vibe that you’re concerned about changing things, but you’re complaining about how it’s done.
But what have you contributed?
I understand that not everyone is cut out to be an activist, nor is there anything that will be appreciated by a dominant culture, no matter WHAT or in WHICH way you protest inequality or demand equality.
I think of men like Lt. Dan Choi or Col. Victor Fehrenbach, who are beyond reproach. You can hardly call them whiners.
And then you have the straight allies, like Dennis and Judy Shepard, reluctant activists, but people who rose to the task nonetheless.
I’ve had the great pleasure to meet members of the old guard like Morris Kight and admire their dedication and stamina, not just for gay equality, but that of blacks and Jews too.
It’s very hard to determine a strategy of reaching people more determined to see you gone, than think of you as a human being at all.
There is a rage out there brewing and gay folks are certainly getting blamed for a lot of the ills hurting many Americans right now, gay and straight.
Nitpicking from you isn’t helping either.
Adam Lambert IS having to adjust to his sudden fame, and he IS talented. He may yet, find it in himself and the time to join whatever fray we can call things right now.
I don’t really care. There are some remarkable people out there already in the game, like ten year old Will Phillips who refuse to say the Pledge of Allegiance until it means what it says for gay Americans too.
Some people are gifted in a different way at activism, and some will have different approaches to it, and I won’t criticize whatever path gets taken.
The point is, Adam Lambert isn’t especially HIDING his light, and the actual winner of Idol is nearly forgotten already.
I am the third generation civil rights activist in my family. And I belong and donate time to several organization and institutions there for the task.
For as long as it takes, so YOU being contrary is predictable as always.
And you might go about your business in whatever way you want, but unless you DO have a strategy anyone cares to hear that’s BETTER and it’s something that can be implemented in ways NEVER TRIED BEFORE…have at it.
posted by Regan DuCasse on
I just thought of something else.
Carrie Prejean got asked a question regarding a hot button issue. She spoke her mind, but not necessarily in an especially creative or intelligent way.
Only because Paris Hilton was ungentlemanly about reacting to it, did the issue get far more traction than it deserved.
But so did Carrie Prejean. Her opinion was latched onto and exploited to the nth degree by a prominent ANTI GAY organization.
Ms. Prejean allowed herself to speak for them (even though they are definitive POLITICAL organization) and to the exclusion of any other duties she was required to perform.
And she presented herself and National Org for Marriage presented her, a beauty queen, like some paragon of virtue and marriage support!
Well being so quick to glom onto her as such, turned out to be a HUGE mistake, didn’t it?
Ms. Prejean is also out there for HERSELF and she’s not smart enough, nor especially virtuous enough to be an activist or politically savvy speaker.
Adam Lambert might know this about himself, that he’s not so qualified really, to be so politically outspoken.
And it might be a huge mistake to assume or expect him to be.
We might give him time to develop those qualities, if he has them, and not be so quick to assume he should.
I for one, think at least the Adam Lambert is more talented and smarter and frankly more uniquely beautiful than Ms. Prejean in a way.
She deserves a closet more too, because she has little more interesting about HER than a coat hanger.
posted by North Dallas Thirty on
Nitpicking from you isn’t helping either.
I think Debrah called out that attitude beautifully.
Many inside the gay community are simply a group of obnoxious people…..ready to help destroy the careers of anyone who will not spend their lives touting the “gay life”.
Prime example, supported and endorsed and participated in by Regan DuCasse.
Hey, hey, ho, ho, Marjorie has got to go!
Blockading a parking lot, trying to shut down and punish a restaurant, all because one of the owners exercised their right to contribute to political causes as they see fit.
And of course, what was Regan doing to those gays and lesbians who chose not to listen to and participate in her blockade?
But the anger was apparent as the few customers of the evening walked in, including a lesbian couple. They were met with angry chanting of “Shame on you, shame on you, shame on you!”
So where was Dan Choi telling the crowd to respect peoples’ rights?
So where was Judy Shepard telling them not to yell hateful things at gays and lesbians?
So where was Will Phillips to tell them not to be abusive to others who disagreed?
Because that would be “equality”.
But of course, this isn’t about “equality”. It’s about maintaining ideological control over a group, just as the Obama Party and Regan’s fellow “civil rights leaders” try to maintain complete control over black people and strip away the minority status of anyone who does not obey them.
So tell us, Regan; do you think it helps the argument when you and people like Phillips, Choi, and Shepard engage in this sort of activity towards other gay people and minority members? Or do you think the obvious hypocrisy of attacking gay people with hate speech and trying to “shame” them publicly for not doing what you demand is resonating with voters as well?
posted by Bobby on
People, you know Lambert didn’t talk about being gay during American Idol (even after the paparazzi found proof).
“Adam Lambert IS having to adjust to his sudden fame, and he IS talented. He may yet, find it in himself and the time to join whatever fray we can call things right now.”
—Is it that hard for a famous person to talk about what he believes? Bruce Willis is a republican, he will go to Iraq and speak to the troops, he was also appointed by Bush as spokesperson for foster care.
Suze Ormon has taken calls from gay couples on her show and has spoken about her views regarding same-sex marriage.
So I’m not going to praise Lambert until he does something worth celebrating. He doesn’t have to become an annoying gay activist but there are ways he can help his community. Maybe he could give a charity concert in San Francisco or perform at the White Party in Miami.
Or you know what would be incredible? Since most songs are about pussy (“I kissed a girl”) why can’t he write a freaking song for men who love men?
“I put Perez Hilton forward as an example to the United States of what “real gays” are like.”
—Sorry North Dallas, gays come in all kinds of shapes, sizes, religions, races, ideology, etc. The fact that 30% of us vote republican even when the GOP makes no effort whatsoever to get our vote (with blacks and jews they spend big money advertising to them yet they can only get 10% of their vote) shows that we are a community that can’t be stereotyped.
And frankly, I happen to like Perez Hilton, he has a wonderful “I don’t give a crap” attitude. Instead of treating himself like a second-class citizen, instead of ignoring gay stories like Liz Smith used to do, he covers everything. In fact, those gay sex pictures he put of an Oscar winning writer where wonderful, thousands of people saw them. Can you imagine TMZ doing the same? Hell no, TMZ would rather put lesbian pictures just because they appeal to straight men.
posted by David Link on
Bobby, you say you won’t praise Lambert “until he does something worth celebrating.” The context suggests you mean something political. But many people think his talent as a singer is “something worth celebrating.” I think it’s fine to use politics as a standard for praise — but it’s not the only one. I would like to be praised for my own musical talents, but that would be pressing the good will of the public — I’m strictly an in-the-car singer, and I’d be out of my element on American Idol — even in the early stages.
Lambert’s performance on the American Music Awards last night was over-the-top; and that includes the censored part where he got a simulated blow-job from a male dancer (there’s a photo at the LA Times). That’s not what I’d call political, except in the weak sense that anyone who’s gay is political by default. But he did it, right there on television, and it’ll be talked about, in the context of him being gay. I don’t have much confidence he’ll have anything useful to say about it politically. But in the context of the song (“For Your Entertainment”) it was certainly successful. Until he chooses to enter another kind of arena, that seems to me the most appropriate standard by which to judge him: his ability as a performer.
posted by Regan DuCasse on
NDT, let’s see.
First of all, I didn’t yell at Marjorie, nor picket her restaurant.
I didn’t especially have sympathy for her though.
HER behavior, when a peaceful and fair meeting was called so that she could talk directly to her otherwise faithful customers.
She didn’t do that, instead she engaged in trying to lay guilt on ‘her friends’ and from a prepared statement, then she left without speaking to anyone.
ONLY then, what happened later.
Thousands and thousands of gay people had to stomach losing their right to marry in CA.
And you think Marjorie suffered more?
She, didn’t listen, nor cared to.
The pain, anger and not wanting to be QUIET and polite all the time is understandable.
What ISN’T understandable is that the dominant culture does it’s dirt, and them complains when gay people don’t want to take it in the face anymore.
The names I mentioned didn’t have to be around to say ‘gee gay people don’t yell at anyone.’
They’ve done far more above and beyond the call.
I’m damn fucking sick and tired of people bringing up El Coyote…because it didn’t suffer ANYTHING really. Marjorie can still go on with her life.
And gay people still can’t get married, not here, not in ME.
There comes a time when people can only take so much NDT.
I don’t AGREE with shouting matches and so on, and I don’t engage in them.
But I sure as shit don’t blame anyone for how they felt after Nov. 4.
Especially when people claiming to have ‘gay friends’ show them what they think of them through the anonymity of the ballot box.
And the affect is hurtful, unnecessary and unfair.
Sometimes people can’t be expected to lose so much and NOT explode somehow.
You think Debrah is right to point out that many gay people are obnoxious?!
Well, what about all the straight people that can look you in the face and treat gay people this way, BEFORE the fact?
A 15 year old gay boy was murdered in Baltimore a few weeks ago.
Jason Mattison, ever hear about that?
He was raped, and strangled and I think stabbed to death by a paroled killer known to Jason’s family.
And I wonder, even with terrible things like this…gay people haven’t lashed out in righteous anger over the brutal death of this well liked, sweet kid?
You still didn’t come up with a BETTER idea, you just pointed a finger.
I’m sick of people bringing up Marjorie Christofferson as if she got lynched or something or her business got firebombed. Let’s get some fucking perspective, shall we? She can obviously take care of herself.
I care about children like Jason Mattison, and every boy and girl just like him, or a child like Will Phillips.
You just remember the difference between and action and a REACTION.
Why don’t you question all those straight people who ACTED against gay folks, BEFORE the noisy rallies and protests even started?
posted by Bobby on
Well, Lambert finally did something worth celebrating:
“Lambert said that he wanted to break down a double standard that existed where female performers are often sexually provocative while men don’t do it that often…The glam rocker sang with an elaborate, S&M-themed production. Lambert fondled a dancer, led another around on a leash, had a dancer briefly stick his head in Lambert’s crotch and kissed a man.”
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091123/ap_en_mu/us_tv_lambert
posted by Regan DuCasse on
He’s going to push an envelope just by showing up.
But he’s right, there IS a double standard. He’s performed better, and I wasn’t all that impressed with this presentation.
But compared to the graceless ways in which Kanye West behaves, Lambert is a peach.
And Lambert CAN sing.
Kanye West is what someone becomes when they don’t have that much talent.
posted by North Dallas Thirty on
Ah, the irony.
I’m damn fucking sick and tired of people bringing up El Coyote…because it didn’t suffer ANYTHING really. Marjorie can still go on with her life.
Oh, of course; she just lost her job and had her business disrupted. You know, last I looked, Regan was saying that that was so traumatic when that happened to gay people that there needed to be a law to prevent it, but when it comes to people Regan doesn’t like, well, forget it.
And I wonder, even with terrible things like this…gay people haven’t lashed out in righteous anger over the brutal death of this well liked, sweet kid?
Probably because there’s a much bigger elephant in the room.
But his paternal grandmother, Wanda Williams, one of the first Jason confided in about being gay and who handed him a few dollars now and then for food and clothes, questioned how other relatives could have allowed the boy to be in the same house with Parrish, given his violent past.
But of course, you see this person as a corpse for you to exploit and use to blame and attack the “dominant culture”, so you have to ignore those details.
People notice that Regan and her fellow liberals have these double standards.
And perhaps my favorite of all:
You think Debrah is right to point out that many gay people are obnoxious?!
Yes, given their behavior of blockading a parking lot, trying to shut down and punish a restaurant, all because one of the owners exercised their right to contribute to political causes as they see fit, and trying to publicly humiliate and shame those gay people who chose not to participate in their blockade.
But of course, again people notice that Regan and her fellow liberals have these double standards.
Really, what this boils down to is this:
What ISN’T understandable is that the dominant culture does it’s dirt
Put bluntly, Regan, you use gay people for the same reason Jesse Jackson does — your blatant anti-white racism is no longer socially acceptable, but you still need to attack and denigrate white people and blame them for all your problems.
Bigots like yourself aren’t picketing black churches or mosques, even though the yes votes for Prop 8 were just as predominant there. That makes it patently obvious to everyone that you are choosing your “outrage” in a manner based more on skin color and minority status as opposed to actual deeds.
posted by Debrah on
“Put bluntly, Regan, you use gay people for the same reason Jesse Jackson does…..”
*********************************
Excellent.
If the “civil rights activists” couldn’t cop a few hurrahs on the grievance parade out of gay issues, they’d be saying aloud and publicly what they say in private.
The black community is filled with some of the most vehemently anti-gay people in this country.
Who in California voted in record numbers against gay marriage?
Yet we don’t hear the “gay activists” taking them to task very often.
Some “boogie men” are more valuable than others, I suppose.
“Bigots like yourself aren’t picketing black churches or mosques, even though the yes votes for Prop 8 were just as predominant there.”
*********************************
Precisely.
And very curious, that.
posted by Regan DuCasse on
You two people don’t know me, and have NO idea what I tried to do FOR Marjorie, and now you think it would have put some balance to the obnoxiousness you’ve criticized and turned it on black people?!
I was already dealing with black folks BEFORE the fact, AND after.
Bishop Franklin Stewart being just ONE of them.
I’m not a pimp among the gay folks USING gay folks whatsoever.
Funny, you’re using the same debate tactics as the most virulently anti gay people out there I know.
You attack, I go on the defensive.
You make unflattering comparisons…you ASSUME I haven’t done what you think I should have.
I put criticism where it’s due and when it isn’t.
Now, here you are, STILL with NO better idea, no suggestions for a BETTER strategy, nothing to contribute except some retread criticism of the SAME stupid incident over and over again.
And here’s the deal about Marjorie.
She didn’t LOSE her job.
She betrayed the majority of her customer base. Which enriched and supported her family and helped to make them prosper.
When you do that, yet publicly call them your friends while privately hurting them, it’s a bad business decision.
Ultimately, after her behavior at the meeting, she just didn’t want to face the people she’d just insulted and betrayed so profoundly.
So she didn’t want to come back to work.
That’s different.
And when a customer has been so insulted, they have every right to picket or have the business know their grievances or…take their business elsewhere.
And although I personally would have skipped the shouting (and did), I won’t be setting foot there anywhere.
I’ve been there three times in my LIFE and I’m an LA native. The food is unforgivably bad, considering all that.
Many restaurants had downturns in the area, and just like having more respect for your customers, that’s the price of doing business.
As for the issue of Jason Mattison.
He’s still dead from a horrible brutal attack. My concerns are NOT misplaced, and I have considered why his killer was even PAROLED, let alone allowed near the family.
But since you’ve decided to take this thread in a direction that serves absolutely nothing regarding the subject (YOU brought up El Coyote).
Adam Lambert will take care of Adam Lambert, and Marjorie is quite recovered from her situation, believe it.
She recovered five minutes after the fact if her hairshirting all over the press was an indication for days after and repetition of that issue does not make it a trend nationwide.
Assume nothing about me, you’ll make the same mistake others have.
You don’t know me, and you’re obviously quite capable of being obnoxious yourself, without offering anything important or that can contribute to the issue.
If you can’t make no more of a contribution than making stupid assumptions and unnecessarily offensive remarks, what makes you think you’re so much better and actually DO better?
BTW….I wouldn’t be able to have the two volunteer jobs and my regular job if I were such a bigot.
Blog threads don’t have the requirements, so any asshole can show up here and throw sh*t at the wall.
Very childish way to try and get a rise out of someone, and really tired.
Give it up why don’t cha?
posted by North Dallas Thirty on
You two people don’t know me, and have NO idea what I tried to do FOR Marjorie
Actually, we know very well what you did to her.
Hey, hey, ho, ho, Marjorie has got to go!
Blockading a parking lot, trying to shut down and punish a restaurant, all because one of the owners exercised their right to contribute to political causes as they see fit.
And of course, what were you also doing to those gays and lesbians who chose not to listen to and participate in your blockade?
But the anger was apparent as the few customers of the evening walked in, including a lesbian couple. They were met with angry chanting of “Shame on you, shame on you, shame on you!”
And here’s the problem:
Now, here you are, STILL with NO better idea, no suggestions for a BETTER strategy, nothing to contribute except some retread criticism of the SAME stupid incident over and over again.
That is because you can’t seem to get the concept that such behavior is obnoxious, unproductive, and completely juvenile. No sane adult would countenance this; it’s the action of a surly, emotionally-immature child who isn’t getting their way and resorts to temper tantrums. It reinforces in peoples’ minds that gays are nothing more than emotional and intellectual infants whose sexual orientation prevents them from being productive and useful members of society.
But then again, that’s understandable. Your goal has nothing to do with making progress on such issues; it’s all about using them as an excuse to lash out, attacking, and trying to hurt the “dominant culture” — or, decoded, your racist hatred of white people and of religious people.
Same with Jason Mattison. Presented with about ten different things that were wrong with his situation, you ignored every single one of them and started attacking white people as being homophobic and causing his death.
That is bullshit. And people are recognizing more and more that your ranting and screaming have more to do with your personal hatred and need to act out on that than any consideration for “civil rights”. When you and your ilk spout how someone can’t consider themselves a black person if they don’t vote or think exactly the way that you do, that makes it clear that your only concern is ramming your own agenda down peoples’ throats using your skin color as a reason.